Can Atheists Find Recovery
In a 12 Step program?

Charlie D. Interviews an Atheist about Recovery in a World without Religion.

Hello, All. Charlie D. at your service. I'm typically known as the rant and raver around these offices and I believe that's why I was chosen to take on this subject; I basically have no problem speaking my mind and additionally no problem opening it up to new ideas.

Today we're going to interview one of our staff writers, James T., who is an Atheist but also a recovering alcoholic.

CHARLIE D.:: First of all, James, thanks for showing up for this interview. I'm told you felt a bit uncomfortable with doing this. Can you tell us why?

JAMES T.: Well there is great amount of prejudice against people of no religion. Most Atheists are "in the closet" about their lack of faith in a religion and feel the need to keep themselves in the closet for fear of being rejected by pears or co-workers.

CHARLIE D.: There are people of many faiths in this office. I've never felt rejected by someone because my faith is different from theirs.

JAMES T.: And that's typical. A Christian will accept a Jew, A Jew will accept a Christian, neither has any problem with someone with a belief in Hinduism or Buddhism, but I can tell you that, in my experience, if one states that they are of NO RELIGION there is an immediate confrontation. I find that people of religion cannot accept that I have no belief in any religion and immediately want to argue the subject.

CHARLIE D.: Maybe it's not an argument? Maybe they are just trying to understand your viewpoint.

JAMES T.: No, it's an argument. When I was wearing the persona of a Christian I never had a Jew or Muslim challenge my belief. It was accepted that I had a religion. When I came out of the closet about my being an Atheist I have had more people, even in this office, confront me and challenge my beliefs. And it's always the same questions. Many of these questions are insulting and make me feel very outcast afterwards. I've often suggested that religion is not a topic I would like to discuss hoping to diffuse the inevitability of an argument but even that does not work. Just the other day a young lady in our office was telling me and another fellow, about a dress she purchased for her daughter's communion. I told her it sounded very nice and that her daughter must be excited. She started telling me about the service and then paused and said, "oh, you wouldn't know anything about that. You're an Atheist"

CHARLIE D.: Well, did you actually know anything about it?

JAMES T.: Yes, of course. Notice how she didn't say this to the fellow standing next to me who is a Jew.
Actually most Atheists know a great deal about religion and the history of more than one religion. This studying of religion is what often leads to someone becoming an Atheist I actually find that I know more about religion than the people who claim to have faith in one. I'm not being arrogant here but this is true. I can't tell you how many people challenge my Atheist lifestyle and then admit that they haven't even read their religion's bible. The most typical response I get when I bring this fact to light is, "I don't need to read a bible to be a good (fill in the blank)."

CHARLIE D.: Well, I must admit, right now I feel like there is a bit of tension between us right now because I feel challenged, man. I'm a Christian. I believe Jesus is my Lord and savior.That he died for our sins. I believe that if I pray to my God and live in his way I will be rewarded in the afterlife. I can't understand how you can just not believe in anything.

JAMES T.: And I sit on this side wondering how you can believe in what you just said.

CHARLIE D.: Why is that so unbelievable to you? I mean, look; The majority of the world believes in a religion. You, my friend, are the minority. All of these people can't be wrong.

JAMES T.: Well, I think they are and for the same reason you just stated. Your perspective is typical of the prejudice that I was speaking of earlier. It's not what religion you believe in that is important, it's that people want you to believe in ONE of them. Any of them. It's not acceptable to most people that Atheists are not part of one of the groups. Let's look at what you just said;
You say that the majority of the world believes in a religion so that must make me out numbered. Not so. Look at that same figure this way: The majority of the world is NOT Christian. There are about two dozen major religions and none of them believe in each other's practices or beliefs. Each one actually believes in their own way and their own God or Gods. Now, if we say only ONE of them is right, then the rest are wrong. So if one out of twenty religions is right that means the majority of the world has to be wrong. It's just not possible for them all to be right.

CHARLIE D.: Maybe we're all understanding God in our own way. Maybe everyone is praying to the same God.

JAMES T.: Then why is there not a One World Religion? And I have to point out that you're using the word "Maybe." Every religion appears to be "guessing" in their own way, not "understanding."
People of all religions believe their faith is the right faith but most people claim their religion because of their parents. You were probably born into a Christian home?

CHARLIE D.: Correct. I'm Catholic. But I find comfort in my God.

JAMES T.: But you are not a Muslim. You are not a Jew. You are a Christian and only because you were born into a home where your parents were Christian. You didn't choose to be a Christian. You didn't check out the other twenty some-odd religions and say, "Hey, this is the right one for me." No, you're a Christian because you were told, by your parents, that you were a Christian.

CHARLIE D.: And that's a bad thing, why?

JAMES T.: I feel that the religious world is filled with brainwashed people who cannot see past their brainwashing. They will fight with their last breath to hold on to their belief in a supernatural being. The brainwashed brainwash their children into believing in this supernatural being or beings depending on the religion.

CHARLIE D.: Supernatural?

JAMES T.: Well it's certainly not "Natural." A Belief in God is outside nature, which is "super-natural." For thousands of years, where there is no explanation for a natural occurrence, people have filled in the blanks with "God's Will." and "God's work." Until Franklin came along and proved that lightning was electricity people actually believed lightning was the "Finger of God." So many of life's mysteries have been answered but one continues to keep the mythology of God of alive.

CHARLIE D.: Death.

JAMES T.: Suddenly you're with me, Charlie. Yes, death. Most humans cannot comprehend that life ends with death. This clinging to life keeps religion alive and the powers that be, who I believe just want to control the masses, create promises of an after life if you follow their way of life.

CHARLIE D.: But that way of life...is it such a bad thing? To love thy neighbor? Thou shall not kill, and so on?

JAMES T.: Truthfully, Charlie. Do you need to believe in a supernatural being to follow these basic humane respects? If you cannot hold yourself back from killing, raping, and stealing unless you believe in a supernatural being, then please...go on believing for the sake of everyone else.

CHARLIE D.: Good point. Okay, I can understand what you're saying but why are so many Atheists so damn angry?

JAMES T.: I don't think we're angry I think we're frustrated by what we see as a crazy world where everyone is believing in some form of "Santa." When someone challenges our lack of belief it's immediately transformed into an argument. It's as if we have to defend ourselves. I think it should be the other way around. I think you and other religious people should defend your beliefs. I, as an Atheist, shouldn't have to endure the barrage of questions asking me to defend myself. Your beliefs are so NOT rooted in any fact and every one of you contradicts the other. Even within the religions there is a conflict. How many forms of Christianity are there? How many different Jewish faiths are there? How many forms of the Muslim religion? Each group changes the rules to suit the leader's needs.

CHARLIE D.: So you believe in the separation of Church and State? What about the freedom of religion?

JAMES T.: Oh, yeah. I believe in the separation. People trying to have prayer in school is just more brainwashing. It's maddening to me to see that and even more frustrating that people, such as myself, have to battle this nonsense. There should be freedom of religion, but there should also be freedom FROM religion. I shouldn't have to sue to have a Christian Cross removed from my local water tower, and I shouldn't have to wonder if my little boy is being subjected to criticism or abuse because he chooses to stand back while other children are told they must pray in a public classroom.

CHARLIE D.: What about the pledge of allegiance? One nation under god? Should they remove that too?

JAMES T.: Yes,. they should. A nation under God is basically no different than Islam. We are not an Islamic nation. We SHOULD be one nation undivided, but some of the "powers that be" want to keep us all divided in our faiths and our extra-national roots. Conspiracy theory? Nobody is an "American" these days. Everyone is an Irish-American, an African-American, Italian-American... And, another thing, people of faith should not have advantages because of their faith. Do you realize that some religious people get to call their homes temples and do not pay taxes? Do you also realize that some religious people use your tax dollars to build their schools because their "faith" prohibits them from attending the public schools? Why am I paying for other people's faiths in , what I believe is, a mythical God?

CHARLIE D.: See? You do sound angry.

JAMES T.: And you're not agreeing with me or responding in a way that makes me feel like you are actually opening your mind to this, Charlie. Let's put it this way. You're Christian. You like the sounds of Church bells calling you to church on Sunday?

CHARLIE D.: I do.

JAMES T.: Well how about this: Just outside your window there is a Mosque and they scream their call five times a day over a loudspeaker? How would that be for you?

CHARLIE D.: Well ...I have nothing against Muslims but I wouldn't want to live next to that and have to hear it five times a day. I would feel like I should move. That must sound awful...but it's true. I wouldn't want to hear that five times a day.

JAMES T. And I believe that's the whole point. You DO have something against them. You don't want to have to integrate their lifestyle with yours. Whether it's church bells or Musin calls, it's a siren that says, "We own this town. This is our neighborhood and you are not welcome." I know Muslims that can't stand the sound of church bells as well. It goes both ways.

CHARLIE D.: So what are you saying, stop ringing the bells?

JAMES T. Stop ringing the bells, stop the calls, and stop the insanity. Stop pushing religion down the throats of people and ripping America apart by the threads. By emphasizing "under God" we are undermining the most important part of the pledge, the part where it says we are indivisible. Religion is keeping us divided. We are a divided nation.
Look I don't want to keep flying off on tangents but do you realize that more people have died in the name of some GOD than for any other reason? To me this is mass insanity.

CHARLIE D.: You're passionate about this. It's making me think. We should, however, get back on topic. Basically, how is it that you, an Atheist, can find recovery in the rooms when you don't believe in God?

JAMES T. Well, first of all it's "God as I understood him" So, I understand him to be a creation of man so, therefore, my "higher power" is not supernatural. It's human and it's organic and it's explainable.

CHARLIE D.: So you admit there is a Higher Power?"

JAMES T.: I admit I am not "all Powerful" and I admit that I am powerless over others and my addiction. But I don't believe in God. I don't believe in any written religion.
I do believe in the power of human goodness. I believe that the people in the rooms accept each other with all of the faults included. I believe that humans need each other more than they need a God and I know that's a higher power. I believe in the power of the collective. I believe that we can heal each other with support, acceptance and, above all, LOVE. For me, none of this requires that I believe in a supernatural force.

CHARLIE D.: If you don't pray, how does the program work for you?

JAMES T.: I believe in meditation. I believe there is an answer in there, in my psyche, somewhere. I believe we all know the answer, we just have to keep asking ourselves and the people who have made it how to get there. I get a feeling of being centered and focused, through meditation, which isn't a belief in God. It's just being centered and focused, and that's a good thing.

CHARLIE D.: What about the Serenity Prayer?

JAMES T. : You know, I would like to accept the things I cannot change. I would like to change things I can and I would love to know the difference between things I can and cannot change. I love those words, but I don't pray that some mystical being zaps me, magically, with the wisdom to understand this concept. I respect this concept and I focus on it daily. But to answer you question from a different side, I don't believe in praying to a God. It is amazing to me that so many people believe that there is some all powerful, all knowing God that NEEDS you to pray to him. If there is a God, and I don't believe there is, why would God need you to pray to him? It just seems to me that prayer gives people some sort of false feeling empowerment as if they can influence the choices their God will make. Kind of like lobbying for their needs to be met.

CHARLIE D.: Interesting thoughts. So, you feel the program has worked for you?

JAMES T.: Without the people in those rooms, with all of their faiths and lack of faiths, I would not be here today.

CHARLIE D.: Thanks, James. I think it was really brave of you to sit with me today and share this viewpoint with us.

JAMES T.: Thanks, Charlie.

(Charlie is still a practicing Christian but suddenly realizes that he has never read his own bible from cover to cover. What may be the results of this reading is left for a future installment.)

WANT MORE JAMES T.? HE'S BACK BY POPULAR DEMAND!

Have some comments you would like to share with either Charlie or James? Write to:

staff.contact@RecoveryWorld.com and put either JAMES T. or CHARLIE D. in the subject line otherwise your e-mail will be deleted automatically.

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